Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 02, 2003 4:52 PM |
hyendole2 |
After a lot of deliberation, I took the plunge. Bought Jaguar on ebay, subscribed to Xpostfacto, partitioned my 9GB disc to a 6GB OSX partition, rest OS9, and double clicked on Xpostfacto. I'm very disappointed with the lack of fiddling, technical jigging and long hours pouring over discussion lists that I had to do. X installed in about 90 minutes, fired up first time and has been rocksolid ever since, mounting all my 4 drives, PCI cards & Lexmark AIO withough problems. Where's the challenge in that? Congrats Ryan (and Apple), you've created great products. Why would I ever want to go back to 9 now? Admittedly there are occasional pauses as the machine struggles, but otherwise it's great. I put the pauses down to the 7300's bus speed, which resembles London Transport in antiquity. Hughy 7300, XLR8 G4@400 256MB, Radeon 7000, Orangemicro USB/FW card, Tempo ATA card, 9GB SCSI, 40GB ATA, 9GB ATA, 40GB on FW, Earthlink cable. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 15, 2003 8:47 AM |
jseibyl |
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Every disk utility does things differently, and does different things. Try both, run a couple of times until the issue goes away, see if issue is corrected. Disk Warrior saved my but a few times, picking up stuff Norton did not, and vice versa. DW and Norton are my two favorites for different things, but you may have to run them a couple of times, sometimes they miss things in the first pass. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 14, 2003 1:53 PM |
rgcost |
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When I correct an error with disk first aid it says it has fixed it. Then I go back and verify and the same problem. mount check errors is still there. Since disk first aid did not fix the problem would this be better corrected with Norton or Disk warrior? Also I get icons on the desktop that are missing like the folder for OS 9. What is the best software for repairing OS X? |
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Floppy Driver for X |
August, 14, 2003 1:06 PM |
jseibyl |
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rgcost.... http://www.macupdate.com/info.php/id/8210 You can try this, I have found that it does work, BUT it is PAINFULLY slow as to make it virtually unusable for me. You also run the risk of currupting a floppy. USB floppies work fine without this driver. It takes my machine about 3 MINUTES to even mount the floppy, just not worth it. If I really need to use the it, I will flop :-) back to 9.2. I rarley need to use floppies these days, The network has one PC and two macs all getting along well, so no prob. powderhaus is correct, that is software issues, not the OS. Disk First Aid, the disk it is repairing is the one that is highlighted...nuf sed. Does the machine boot?? Is it running without kernel panic?? If so then the OS is fine, but you still need to tweak your apps just as you did when you first ran os 9. The 2930 card..... Are the drives properly ID'ed, are the IBM's set to auto spinup and disable unit attention?? Is the one at the end of the scsi chain properly terminated?? Can you hear the drives spin up when you cold boot?? These are the same issues as they would be in OS 9, EXCEPT X is more sensitive that they should be perfect, 9 has some slop built in on that. The PC card, I would be surprised if it runs at all, since you say it only runs in 8.6. I would yank it for now UNTIL everything else is okay (drives, etc). You can run the Wintel shell through Virtual PC without that card, so I am wondering why you want it in the first place, the PC chip is probally slower anyway since I am guessing it is ancient (100 mhz??). Jag is completely different than the old OS, it is based on the most stable OS out there....Open BSD UNIX, not too far from Linux, BUT NOT the old OS of MAC. If you can get a handle on it, it IS rock solid, but if you are trying to run old hardware that you can't even run in OS 9, you WILL run into issues, especially on a machine that is running a proc that is two generations removed from what it was originally designed for. (g4). Because X is so different, you have to adjust to it if you want to run it (ie...different keyboard shortcuts). It will not be your old machine, if you are looking for that...stay with 9. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 13, 2003 10:42 PM |
mhache |
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I just wanted to drop a line to let everyone know I just installed 10.2 on a UMAX S900 with an 8 gig HDD (3 partitions), 208 MB RAM using xpost facto. Only issue I ran into was that I didnt have as much space on the partition I earmarked with xpost and so I tried to change it during installation to the 3rd part. which had more than enough room and it freaked. After a restart into 9.2 I just made sure I picked the right partition the first time and it went smoothly. ONe other weird thing was that I was using an old mac monitor while it was installing so I could read up on my PC in the forums and the monitor got cooked....it was an 8 yr old mac monitor so maybe it was just coincidence...or the default refresh rates were just too much for it lol...poooof! |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 11, 2003 4:54 PM |
powderhaus |
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also the developer has released a fix to the problem with the latest version, he said that there was a problem with the registration that messed up the program. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 11, 2003 4:13 PM |
powderhaus |
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those problems are problems with the applications, for IE, don't use it, use safari, iCab or a mozilla variant. For the weather watcher thingy you probably have to tell it in its prefs to start up at log in. if it still does not work then it is a problem with the program, and has nothing to do with MacOSX or Xpostfacto. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 11, 2003 4:02 PM |
rgcost |
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Yesterday I filled out the auto complete form in internet explorer and today nothing is there. It makes me thinks that there is a problem somewhere. I installed pop up weather in the menu and this morning it was not running either. How come they say this system is so stable? |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 10, 2003 10:37 PM |
rgcost |
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I checked ASP and it recognizes the 2930 board but shows nothing attached to it. I have two IBM drives attached to the 2930 that show up in OS 9.22. Now how do I get the drives to appear on the desktop in Jaguar? Somewhere I saw a link to a driver for the floppy was it the Xpostfacto page? Has anyone gotten it to work? |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 10, 2003 7:21 PM |
powderhaus |
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i think Opendarwin used to make a driver or floppies but i can't find it and souceforge.net (where it probably would be) is down, so check there from time to time. It may require the use of the terminal but probably not. for your windows board i would say no, but maybe not, check around, www.macupdate.com, www.versiontracker.com or even www.google.com/mac to search for OSX drivers. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 10, 2003 4:24 PM |
rgcost |
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I put the 2930 card in and it was recognized in 9.2 but not in Jaguar. I installed the drivers and still nothing. How do I get the floppy drive recognized? I am not into going to the terminal either it is hard enough trying to make sure it is running right. I ran disk first aid and it had to make a lot of repairs. How do you know which one is repairing what and if it is doing it correctly? Apple made a windows board which will run Window 95 or 98. Yes it is similer to Orange Mico. By hitting two keys you can switch to the other board and work on another system. Right now it is only compatible with OS 8.6 and I don't think OS X will sense it but since it doesn't like the 2930 card who knows. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 08, 2003 11:47 AM |
jseibyl |
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"I do have Apple's windows board do you think I can put that back in now that everything is loaded?" Is this like an orange micro PC emulation board??? Not sure what you are saying here. If it is, that might be the bag of tomatoes right there, I have not seen, heard, or tried running something like that that in jag. Please be more specific, thanks. As far as networking machines, Yes, I have an windoze XP laptop, used a crossover eternet cable to my mac, fired up the dialup on the mac after making sure file sharing and internet connection sharing was on, and was surfing from the laptop with little difficulty. Try the 2930 install, but DON'T put anything on it yet, just put the card in to see if your sys prof can read it. If it is being recognised, try something on it. I tried this with mine, and couldn't even see it, so a bailed on it and am running it in my 8500 in 9.2, works fine there. The external Sony should be fine, you will not be able to use it for iTunes, or iPhoto, as Apple blocked drives other than the factory internals for this, but I use mine with Toast and it is just ducky. There are workarounds, but that is another topic that requires modifying things in the terminal that I have not tried, nor care to, so I won't go there..... |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 07, 2003 3:59 PM |
rgcost |
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My cd burner is a Sony Spressa external cd burner. Last night I downloaded 2930 drivers and installed in OS X. I also found drivers for my Kensington turbo mouse and the Iomega drive. I have drivers in OS 9.2.2. for my Color Stylewriter 4500. I do have Apple's windows board do you think I can put that back in now that everything is loaded? I read that X 2.6 recognizes windows computers. Someone said they are going to bring out another faster windows board than the one I have. Since the rest of my family has windows maybe we can get networked other than just for the DSL. I don't want to screw this up after it has taken this long to get it to run. What a job, like pulling hens teeth. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 07, 2003 7:14 AM |
jseibyl |
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Goota luv disk warrior, saved my but a few times :-). Glad to hear things are okay. I have had no luck with my 2930, but others might have. I have had good experience with 2940's, but the three I have played with all were originally PeeCee versions, that I flashed. Ironically, the 2930 IS SUPPOSED to work, and the 2940 IS NOT, go figure. Is you burner external? I have an external HP plugged into my 2940 card, works well. I also tried it on the mainboard scsi external which also works fine. If you have an internal, I don't see why it wouldn't, agian provided it has the proper termination, if needed, and ID. Again glad to hear you are running! Jim |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 06, 2003 6:18 PM |
rgcost |
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Yahoo !! It finally worked. I tried Norton Utilities and I had directory errors that it tried to fix but it still wouldn't boot so I erased X and this time I used Disk Warrior twice on an empty partition. Then I loaded OS X. I tried updating in OS X to X.1 and got errors so I went back to 9.22 and used Disk warrior to repair and rebuild the directories. I then used Xpostfacto to load the upgrade X.1 after that installed and I updated from the website, I went back to 9.22 and checked the directories then I installed X.2. I am now upgrading to X 2.6. Now the big question is what can I put back in? I guess the 2930 board is out? Right and I need a 2940? for compatibility. How about my scsi Sony cd burner? Any ideas? |
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powderhaus |
August, 06, 2003 7:22 AM |
jseibyl |
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good call, if those ID's are correct, the machine would probally not boot at all. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 05, 2003 5:42 PM |
powderhaus |
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Quantum 4 gig apple rom, scsi bus 1, id 1 IBM 18 gig partition 7.99/9.9 for X & 9 with Apple Drivers scsi id 1 bus 1 i may be reading this wrong but it does look like your SCSI ids are a little off. This line you wrote sounds like you have to drives on the same Bus with the same SCSI id (that being bus 1 ID 1) Make sure that none of your drive on the same scsi bus have the same ID number. also make sure that the first and last devices on the SCSI chain are terminated. Before you boot turn on verbose mode in the advanced menu in XPF. when you start you should get some kind of error. copy the error and a few lines before it and post them here so we can better understand what is happening during the boot. Good Luck! Jim |
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rgcost |
August, 05, 2003 5:01 PM |
jseibyl |
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This IS the easiest way to put X on an old machine. Some machines have some issues along the way, but they usually boil down to hardware. There are also people who just did it, and it worked. I have had both easy no prob installs, and some issues on 2 different 8500's, turned out to be a scsi ID issue.... Every machine is different because of the hardware inside it. Once X is is, it IS rock solid, and runs VERY well on these macs. Specific problems I have seen, RAM issues SCSI ID and timing on drives if you use scsi Cards that are not compatible with X, Jaguar is MUCH better here.. or some other hardware thing specific to your machine. If you really want to do this, yank out EVERYTHING that is un-needed, extra dirve, PCI cards, anything that is NOT critical to get the machine running. Do ALL upgrades BEFORE you start putting stuff back in. And add ONE thing in at a time and see what happens. You only need two partitions to have this work, one for 9.1, and one for X. If you have 9.2.2 on another drive, leave it off until you get to the version of X you want to stay with. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 05, 2003 4:29 PM |
jseibyl |
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I probally don't need my OS 9.1 install anymore, but it doesn't take up much space, and it is just a third option to boot the machine in case of a MAJOR disaster. Being paranoid, I hang onto it. Remember you are trying to do something your MAC was never designed to do. I don't really use the terminal for anything, unless it is some propeller head hack I want to try. You really don't need UNIX knoweledge to do this. Still sounds like your timing on your scsi drives is off. As a final solution, you could just get the full install for 10.2 and go with that, I started with 10.1, so I never tinkered with earlier versions. I do know that 10.2 works great, I have done it on several machines. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 05, 2003 1:44 PM |
rgcost |
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I have a cache enabler with Sonnets software and when I tried to install the other enabler in X it didn't work. I tried updating while in X with X.1 last nite and I had a new problem a Kernel error now the 10.04 will not restart so I will have to erase and start over I was running os 9.2.2 on the other partition. I am reading different theories on how many partitions are suppose to be in, one for os X, one for os classic to operate, and one for os 9. The other is just for two what is right? Is there a simpler way to figure this out? I am not a unix person. |
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RE: Disappointed rgcost |
August, 05, 2003 8:48 AM |
jseibyl |
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Also, sounds like the scsi timing is off, I had to change ID numbers on some of the drives that worked great in 9.2. X is VERY touchy about scsi timing, it must be perfect(whatever that is...)or things go bad fast. Here is my rig.... Main scsi bus... Stock 2 gig drive terminated (9.1) ID 0 Stock CD ID 3 4 gig Seagate barracuda (OS X.2.6) ID 6 (yes...6, that is what it wanted) External mobo scsi..... Lino/Hell scanner ID 4 2940 card..... IBM ultrastar 18 gig OS 9.2.2 (term) ID 1 IBM ultrastar 18 gig #2 ID 3 HP CDRW ID 5 (on external card bus-NOT terminated) I found that for some reason, if the ID's are spaced out a bit, the machine seems to run smoother. The 4 gig drive with my X installed did not work on any other ID number, not sure why. I found the sweet spot by trial and error, and taking notes. I originally tried to use sequential ID numbers, but that gave me nothing but trouble with all the NON-standard stuff I have. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 05, 2003 8:06 AM |
jseibyl |
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I had problems with my allegedly apple native 2930 card (full Apple ROM) when I tried to go to X, getting the same scsi errors. I tried flashing the card, hitting the sites, etc, all to no avail. I was about to give up on the project, when I had a "What the Heck" moment. I had an Adaptec 2940 sitting in my windoze machine not connected to anything as it is all firewire for the peripherals now. I yanked the card, flashed it to be a Power Domain 2940, threw it in my 9500, fired it up. To my astonishment, it worked great in 9.2. I threw two drives on it, took a deep breath, and tried to go to X, not expecting it to work at all, as the card is not supposed to be supported. Again to my astonishment it worked, and has been stable ever since. Under sys prof in X, it shows up as a 2940. I still have NOT been able to get my 2930 card to work in X, so it is sitting in my spare 8500 which is running 9.2. I have since flashed two other "windoze" 2940's for friends, and have had the same luck. Not sure if this helps or just gives you more head-aches, but my 2930 card has some issues in X despite the fact that it is "supposed" to be fully supported. |
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RE: Disappointed with OSX :-) |
August, 04, 2003 8:10 PM |
rgcost |
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Here are my specs: OS 9.2.2 9600/300 Mach 5 Sonnet 800 Mhz upgrade card 640 Mb ram ATI Rage 128 Quantum 4 gig apple rom, scsi bus 1, id 1 IBM 18 gig partition 7.99/9.9 for X & 9 with Apple Drivers scsi id 1 bus 1 CD id 3, zip id 5 Adaptec 2930 not installed 2/ 2 18 Gig IBM on it Apple Windows board not installed What I want to know is the mother board terminated I am getting ioscsi,multimedia patch errors loading OS X.1 |
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Ginger Cost |
August, 04, 2003 10:42 AM |
jseibyl |
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BTW, if you have osx running, you can upgrade it directly WITHOUT running XPF OR SonnetX. You just have to update while the machine is in OSX. I installed 10.1, then went to Jaguar, then updated each time a new patch came out. Only used XPF once. |
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Ginger Cost |
August, 04, 2003 10:32 AM |
jseibyl |
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What is your machine/specs?? |
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