XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 08, 2002 11:54 PM |
durisinm |
I am attempting to use XPF 2.2.4 to install OS 10.1 on my beige G3 running OS 9.2.2. It was originally a 266MHz system with 128MB of RAM. I have replaced the CPU with a 500MHz ZIF CPU and increased the RAM to 768MB. I have also replaced the original 4GB IDE boot drive with a 40GB drive and added an additional internal 9GB IDE drive and an 18GB internal SCSI drive. For now I work mainly in OS 9.2.2 installed on the 40GB drive. The OS 10.1 installer CD wouldn't boot on my system. The only way I could install OS 10.1 previously was to remove the target 18GB SCSI drive, put it in a second stock beige G3 with no alterations, perform the installation, and bring the drive back to the original G3. According to Apple's instructions for beige G3s, I installed OS 10 in a partition on the very first 8GB of the SCSI drive. That worked, and I was then able to boot into OS 10.1, install the developer tools, and upgrade to 10.1.5. I want to eventually upgrade to OS 10.2 *without* needing to shuffle my hard drive to another computer and back, so I tried XPF. I first tried to use it to boot the 10.1 installation CD after specifying that the location of my OS X installation was where I had already installed it on the SCSI drive. It looked like XPF started to work. Messages appeared on a black screen, but it stalled and began writing multiple "waiting for root device" messages to the screen. The XPF troubleshooting advice suggests that this is caused by some sort of problem with the CD-ROM. My Mac has the original 2X DVD-ROM that it came with. I tried another experiment. I reformatted my 40GB IDE drive with OS 10.1.5 from the SCSI drive, created another 8GB partition at the beginning of the IDE drive to hold OS 10, and moved my existing OS 9.2.2 files to a new partition occupying the rest of the drive. This time when I launched XPF and told it to install OS 10 to the 8GB IDE partition I didn't get *any* output on my screen at all, and my system eventually rebooted into OS 9.2.2 by itself. I tried the suggestions in the troubleshooting advice for holding down Command-V during booting, slowing down the CPU with the throttle settings, and trying the Open Firmware menu, but I was never able to get any output no matter what I tried, and my system always booted back into 9.2.2. I sent the XPF log file from my OS 9.2.2 System Folder to Ryan Rempel before I figured out how to access this forum so that he could review it. Does anyone have any suggestions for me? Taking my drive to another computer for OS 10 installations is a pain in the neck, and I would love it if XPF would allow me to get around that. |
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RE: XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 21, 2002 9:32 PM |
dvyoung5 |
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i have problems to booting in osx from a g4533 overclocked at 600 i found that putting the original266 back in worked but whenever i go back to nine which has my music apps and games i cant get back in to osx even if i switch the ziffs back so i have to do an install over again, what a pain. |
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RE: XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 15, 2002 9:04 PM |
durisinm |
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I swapped the master/slave designations for my spare IDE drive and my DVD-ROM on the second ATA bus. The DVD is now the master, as it originally was, and the hard drive is now the slave. I was very happy to discover that the OS 10.1.3 install CD booted properly; I didn't even need XPF to perform the installation even though my G3 still had all its nonstandard drives, RAM, and CPU! I figure that I now have at least a decent chance of getting OS 10.2 installed, so I'm going to order it and give it a try. |
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RE: XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 12, 2002 6:51 AM |
durisinm |
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I took my own suggestion and copied the OS 10.1.3 installation CD's files to a hard drive in a directory of a partition where OS 10.1.5 was already installed, used the Startup Disk control panel to specify the 10.1.3 System Folder, and rebooted. My Mac came up in OS X, but it wouldn't run the OS X Installer. I got a message something to the effect of, "You can't run this program from this device." |
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RE: XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 11, 2002 8:00 AM |
durisinm |
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I remember now why I made the DVD-ROM the slave when I installed the second IDE drive as the master. That IDE drive is a Maxtor, and its installation instructions recommended that it be the master. So I set the drive's jumpers to make it the master and reset the DVD-ROM's jumpers to make it the slave. I guess I need to switch those around and see if both devices still work, and I can also try cable select as the setting for both devices. Does anyone know if it's possible to copy the OS X installation CD's files to a hard drive and perform the installation from there? My guess is that for a G3 Mac like mine the files would have to exist in the first partition on the drive and that the partition be <=8GB in size. The installer boots into OS X to perform the installation, and those partition requirements are what Apple says is needed to run OS X on a beige G3. |
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RE: XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 11, 2002 7:03 AM |
durisinm |
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I think I've seen the same thread on the Apple chat board. People there are talking about removing anything that didn't come with the original computer. I have a lot of upgraded devices in my system, including the RAM, and I want to find a way to perform OS X installations without having to remove them each time. Pulling nonstandard devices out may work to get 10.2 installed, but what will happen when Apple releases 10.3, 10.4, etc.? I don't want to go through that each time. I'm hoping that XPF will allow me to perform the installations without messing with the guts of my system. |
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RE: XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 10, 2002 9:35 PM |
kbata |
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I saw a thread on Apples chat boards that talked about the screen blacking out during the install on Beige G3's. The solution for those people was to remove extra RAM and then run the installation. Once Jag is installed you can put your RAM back in. That solution worked for several people that were having that type of an install problem. |
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RE: XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 10, 2002 9:24 PM |
OSXGuru |
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Yes, that could help. As you say, the "waiting for root device" message means that there is some problem accessing the CD (or DVD in your case). So switching between master/slave could conceivably help. |
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RE: XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 10, 2002 9:56 AM |
durisinm |
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I used the Apple Profiler and noticed that my DVD-ROM drive is listed as 1 on its ATA channel; I believe that means it is configured as the slave. It was probably originally the master, and I probably changed it when I installed the second IDE hard drive. I have seen some people claim that the drive (DVD or CD) holding the OS X installation CD should always be the master, not the slave. Can anyone confirm that? Should I go back and make the DVD the master and the second hard drive the slave? Could this have something to do with why XPF isn't working for me? |
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RE: XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 10, 2002 7:00 AM |
kbata |
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I had my brother remove all his cards on his Beige G3 and try to install 10.2 onto his new IDE drive. The install seems to be going ok but at some point the screen goes black and never comes back. I have a feeling that the install may actually be going OK but the video goes to sleep and he can't see the instructions when it gets to the point where it wants the second CD. He has had lots of problems in the past with his built in video not coming on during booting both with OS X and OS 9. I wonder if he put in his ATI 7000 video card for the install if it would get him past that problem. Has anyone had similar problems with their built in video in the Beige G3? |
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RE: XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 09, 2002 8:22 AM |
durisinm |
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The upgraded ZIF 500MHz CPU is a G3 from IBM, not a G4. I don't remember where I bought it, but it was advertised as being a drop-in replacement for the original 266MHz G3. The new CPU sits in the same spot the original one did; it isn't mounted on a carrier card. It has no software to control any of its functions, or at least it didn't come with any. When I called Apple tech support I was advised to replace the original CPU before installing any flavor of OS X, but I hate to crack open my computer and rearrange its guts every time I want to boot an OS X installer disk. There's got to be a better way, and I'm hoping that XPF is it. |
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RE: XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 09, 2002 7:01 AM |
kbata |
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My brother has been having troubles installing 10.2 on his Beige. He had 10.1 installed on an internal SCSI drive and just installed a larger IDE drive that he planned to load with 10.2. I told him to leave the install of 10.1 alone on his SCSI and install 10.2 within the first 8 gig's of the IDE drive but he tried to install over the existing install and it failed. Now he can't boot into X from his original drive and when he attempts to load X from the install CD things are very slow and it tells him that the installation has over 7 hours to go before it finally fails. He has just recently replaces his 500 MHZ Newer Tech G3 card with a OWC G4 card. Would using Xpostfacto in any way help or hurt his chances of getting a successful install? |
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RE: XPF 2.2.4 not working for beige G3 |
December, 09, 2002 1:04 AM |
paul_findley |
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Is your new ZIF CPU a G4? I read there are problems in selecting a boot drive with a G4 upgrade in a beige G3, although I don't know the details. Both Sonnet and XLR8(defunct) developed there own little startup disk control panels to select a boot drive for G4-upgraded Beige G3s. Don't know if your problem is related to the difficulties they were addressing. |